PVP Battle Pet Rewards: Suggestions From A Collector

Let's talk about the new PVP battle pet rewards, shall we? Yes, we're opening that can of worms.

2 sets of Honor rewards already exist: the Dutiful companions and Wyrmtongue pets (both with faction-specific pets). These are awarded upon earning Honor Level 5 and Honor Level 20 respectively.

BFA adds a new set of faction pets to earn from PVP'ing, two crabs, Sir Snips and Bucketshell. You need to reach Honor Level 400 for these new pets.

If the jump from 20 to 400 seems like a massively gigantic one, it's because it is. Even objectively, the number 400 is such a huge leap from 20 (a 380 difference), nevermind how much Honor is involved in that.

Speaking of which, let's explore how much. A player from the Bnet Pet Battle forums did the math, and let's just say it's pretty discouraging from a non-PVP'ers point of view. (note: calculations aren't taking into consideration Honor is account-wide and alts can boost daily earnings)


4.3 years of PVP WQs for one character. I honestly don't even know if World Quests will still be a feature that far down the line.

To be frank, I think it's unreasonable. Disclaimer: I'm biased, and I'm viewing this from a pet collector's and non-PVP'ers point of view.

I'm not saying that battle pet rewards shouldn't be in PVP (or any other non-Pet Battle activity), but that huge gap between the existing PVP rewards and the new ones is inconsistent and excessive. Even the mounts rewarded from the new Honor system don't have such a large jump from goalpost to goalpost. You receive a mount from Honor 15, 40, 70, 125, 150, 250, and 500.

Am I suggesting Blizzard add more battle pets in between to make it similar to the mounts? NO. PLEASE. NO. I'm simply pointing out the ridiculousness of the requirement jump for the battle pets. (The whole "pets = mounts" (which I don't necessarily believe) is an entirely different discussion.)

Why does it matter if it's unreasonable and discouraging? It's pushing away potential participants. Players who feel it's impossible to attain a goal will not take part and/or simply quit. This isn't a threat. It's human nature. It's much easier to press on and continue when the desired outcome feels obtainable.

Collectors want to complete their collection as much as possible. If that's no longer possible due to a reward that's readily in the game, it's incredibly disheartening and makes it that much easier to never get started and/or stop.

     
Suggestions
Here are a couple of suggestions on how to adjust the PVP rewards in the future. I'd prefer compromises instead of 'all or nothing'. I'm sure there are other ideas that address collectors' concerns as well.

Rotate the rewards after the next PVP season ends. Or even after BFA ends. Place the crab pets at a lower tier in the future.

This was already done with the Dutiful and Wyrmtongue pets at the launch of Patch 8.0 (they were awarded in a different order prior to the pre-patch), which made the later pets more accessible to those that were unable to obtain them previously. It was a very welcome change that did not take anything away from the system. My hope is that Sir Snips and Bucketshell will also be rotated to a (much) lower and more reasonable reward tier. Perhaps Honor 75 or Honor 100.

Actual PVP'ers will get the prestige of owning the newest items first, but others will also get a chance to collect them, even if they have to wait for a while. It won't seem like an impossible feat for non-PVP'ers, and it will give others that aren't hardcore in X-activity a chance too. It won't be as discouraging, and would encourage continual, active participation. Because let's face it, who wants to keep chasing after a carrot if they can't even see the carrot anymore?

Another suggestion is to place "old" PVP season rewards on a vendor, purchasable for Marks of Honor. Nothing is removed, and this would also make room for newer rewards (which I'm sure PVP'ers would appreciate). Give non-PVP'ers a way to earn Marks consistently, and it won't feel like an impossible task.

And yes, players will still need to grind and participate to be eligible for rewards. These suggestions aren't meant to be seen as an "easy win" for anyone. Many collectors are willing to put effort into non-Pet Battle activities, but within reason.

-----------------

TLDR; Pet collectors feel the gap between Honor 20 and Honor 400 for the pets is excessive and unreasonable.

Suggestions on future changes that will not take away rewards, but make seemingly impossible feats more doable:

1. Rotate the rewards so that the crab pets appear at a lower tier in future PVP seasons (or at the end of the expansion).

or

2. Once the PVP season ends, take existing rewards and place them on a vendor for Marks of Honor. Add a way for non-PVP'ers to earn Marks. Add new rewards to earn for active PVP'ers.

And I think this goes without saying, but Please. Stop. Adding Battle Pets. As PVP. Rewards. There are other (better) rewards for PVP'ers to show off... that's for another discussion though. :P

Patch 8.0 - Miscellaneous Notes & Known Issues

Patch 8.0 this week! Pet Battle patch notes can be found here.

Miscellaneous changes/updates and known issues:

- Recruit-A-Friend system was updated. Adjusted requirements and a more streamlined process. Updated guide on RAF'ing yourself for the pets.

- Vendor that sells the PVP pet rewards was not updated for Patch 8.0. After earning the Dutiful and Wyrmtongue companions on one faction, you should be able to purchase the other faction's pet. However, the vendor still lists previous-patch Prestige requirements instead of the new Honor Level achievements. Hopefully Blizzard sorts that out soon.

Update: Appears to be fixed. Eligible players should be able to purchase the pets from Captain Roberts (A) and Sarah the Savage (H).

- 'Polymorphed wild pets' trick possibly nerfed in 8.0. These wild pets show up as the polymorphed version in the Pet Journal, but appear as the normal (actual) pet when summoned.

Update: Does not seem to work anymore, even on freshly polymorphed wild pets post-patch.

- Brutus, Rooter, and Thundering Serpent Hatchling not showing up properly even if collected when re-importing collection to WarcraftPets (resulting in an incorrect total number of unique pets collected).

Update: It looks like this issue is being resolved for a few. Some may still see an incorrect total pets collected. Hopefully a full fix will come in a day or two.

- Those that completed the Uuna storyline will notice that she's missing her flower crown, wand, and teddy bear when summoned. She still has her flower crown when viewed in the Pet Journal, but that's it.

Update: Known issue, developers are investigating.

- The original "shiny" Mountain Cottontail turned into a color-changer in 8.0 instead of using the golden bunny skin. It doesn't seem to use the gold skin in its rotation, despite it appearing with it in the Pet Journal. The new silver-shiny Mountain Cottontail remains unchanged.

- Some players are experiencing bugs while in-game and attempting to Pet Battle. Issues range from, but are not limited to, not being able to swap pets in and out of the active team, "locked" Pet Battles despite only one WoW account on the Bnet account, to unable to initiate a pet encounter.

Update: Outdated Pet Battle addons are likely the cause. Either disable or update your addons and try to Pet Battle again.

That's it for now. Will add to this list if anything else pops up.

The Road to Prestige 7 Companions

I finally earned Prestige Rank 7 this past Thanksgiving holiday. Hooooooraaaay!

*many sighs of relief* It only took me... a year and 3 months lol.

Woot! Dutiful companions collected!
(ﾉ^ヮ^)ﾉ*:・ﾟ✧ pic.twitter.com/DDG5qGugNw

— Quintessence (@perksnpeeves) November 24, 2017

For those still working on and/or dreading the Prestige grind, don't take how long it took me to heart. I wasn't consistent and periodically took LOTS of time off from doing PVP WQs.

If you do 3 Towers plus at least 1 FFA WQ a day (with Battle Standard of Coordination dropped for all of them), it will take you roughly 178 days (or about 6 months) to reach Prestige 7 from scratch.

Here are some numbers (this Wowhead PVP guide is useful):

Prestige 1 - Alliance Enthusiast and Horde Fanatic

Honor 0 to Honor 50 (first time) = need 22,000 Honor

Prestige 7 - Dutiful Squire and Dutiful Gruntling

44,000 Honor for each Rank after x 6 Ranks = need 264,000 Honor

22,000 + 264,000 = need 286,000 Honor total


Honor Earned Daily

PVP Tower WQ = 345 (with Battle Standard)
PVP FFA WQ = 575 (with Battle Standard)

345 x 3 = 1035 + 575 = 1610 Honor earned daily

286000/1610 = ~178 days to Prestige 7

If you do battlegrounds/arenas, you can earn even more and the grind will go even quicker. However, the PVP WQs are just the basics and bare minimum.

6 months may seem like a long time, but considering the current estimation for the next expansion is some time summer of 2018, if you were to start the Prestige grind RIGHT NOW and stick with it, you should earn Prestige 7 before Battle For Azeroth.

Also, keep in mind that Blizzard's current plans are to keep these rewards post-Legion. They might not, however, be earned in the same method as currently, in BfA. We still don't know how they'll be awarded in the future, but at least we have peace of mind that they will not be Legion-exclusive.

If you can't earn these companions now, you *should* be ok and have the opportunity to (possibly in a different way) in the expansion. !!! DISCLAIMER !!!: THIS IS SUBJECT TO CHANGE AND NOT SET IN STONE; complete the Prestige grind or don't using your own discretion.

Some tips for grinding to Prestige 7:

Developer Q&A - RE: Prestige Rewards Post Legion

There was a live Developer Q&A today, and I'm just getting a chance to sit down and watch. No pet battle questions were directly answered, but we did get a bit of clarification on what will happen to the PVP Prestige pets post-Legion.

Here's a clip of when Game Director Ion Hazzikostas addresses Prestige. Keep in mind that this does NOT guarantee ANYTHING. If you watch earlier (couldn't clip the entire Prestige answer), he notes that they're still unsure but re-evaluating what to do with Prestige, Honor, and the whole thing in BfA. It does lean more toward making current Prestige rewards still available, even after this expansion is over. Perhaps in a different manner than how we obtain the rewards now, but still available.


"Regardless, we want to make sure the Prestige rewards that are currently available will still be available in whatever form we have in the future. We'll have more information to come basically."

This is better news than no news at all, IMO. I'm glad to hear that their current plan is to not simply retire the current rewards come BfA.

Even with this news, I still plan on finishing up my grind to Prestige 7 this month. I'm so close, I don't plan on quitting now. Today's developer response is great for others who may want to take it much more slowly though! If you're "behind" on the Prestige grind, that's ok! There's time. At least for now. Couldn't hurt to get started a little bit by little bit sooner instead of later though. ;)

You can watch the full Dev Q&A, or read about it on Wowhead.

Thoughts On 7.3 PVP Prestige Companion Change

In Patch 7.3, collectors discovered an undocumented change made by Blizzard to the PVP Prestige companions. Those that reached Prestige Rank 1 and Rank 7 on one faction could use a level 100+ alt of the opposite faction and buy the companions of the same earned rank(s). Originally you needed to complete the rank up four different times, twice on alliance and twice on horde. The 7.3 adjustment means the grind to collect all four companions is essentially cut in half.

Needless to say, there are passionate feelings on either side of this; it's a pretty divisive topic. I understand both sides, and each has some valid points.

My personal take on this change? I'm glad for it and I think it's great for the collecting community overall. The communication and execution was less than desirable though, and that's where my biggest criticisms lie.

Lament of a Non-PVPer - Brainstorming Ideas For More Accessible PVP Pets

Lately I've been diligently completing the PVP tower WQs on my main (alliance) and an alt (horde). But this hasn't always been the case -- I admit that up until this point, I haven't been keeping up with the PVP WQs. Like at all. And I fully recognize that it's because of my own laziness and aversion to anything PVP-related that I'm so behind on Prestige ranks (barely halfway to Prestige 2 on my alliance, and a little further on my horde).

I also realize that it's kind of silly to be so against Honor grinding this expansion when PVP tower WQs are available. They're more PVE than PVP. BUT! I must mention that I HAVE had someone of the opposite faction try to kill me at one of the PVP towers. Luckily I was on my Druid so it was fairly easy to run away. I couldn't go back to finish that WQ for a few hours though, for fear of being drawn into actual PVP again. And the free-for-all WQs? I don't even try.


Alliance Enthusiast - reward from Prestige rank 1
Anyway, all of this has made me realize how demoralizing this grind is. The desired end goal of this grind (Prestige 7 for the Dutiful Squire and Dutiful Gruntling) seems SO very far away for a non-PVPer that's lagging behind.

The end of Legion is probably still a ways off, but there's still some anxiety/panic for me when it comes to these PVP pets. So far, developers have offered up zero information on whether or not the current Prestige rewards will be available after this expansion ends and the next expansion begins.

Expansion-exclusive rewards would mean there's only so much time left to grind your face off to reach desired ranks. Added pressure of a deadline makes it even less enjoyable, especially for someone like me who didn't like this task to begin with.

What could developers do to make the PVP pets more accessible as we get later and later into Legion? Or even possibly after Legion? I took to Twitter and brainstormed a little with a couple of others!

• Reduce amount of Honor required for each Prestige rank
  

  I believe they did this for Prestige 1, but the others were increased. To make it take less time before the expansion ends, I think reducing the Honor required to reach each rank would help a lot.

• Change requirements for PVP pets completely (not Legion-Prestige related) and make them available on a vendor
  

  Currently the pets are tied to Prestige 1 and 7, but what if the requirements were changed? Maybe complete a new quest? Or new achievement? And then you're allowed to purchase the pets off a vendor.

• Make the pets cageable (I'm not a fan of this one in this specific situation)
  

  The reason why I'm not a fan of these pets being cageable is because developers seem to WANT them to be exclusive, and WANT us to participate in a specific activity to earn them. Cageable would go against that design philosophy.

• Increase Honor gain (suggested by @noeldillabough)
  

  Increased Honor earned from simple PVP-related tasks would help a bunch. Coupled with lowered required Honor to reach each rank, would make the race to collect these pets before the end of the expansion less stressful.

• Purchasable for Marks of Honor (and possibly a next expac-Prestige rank requirement? preferably reasonably low rank :P) (suggested by @liopleurodonic)
  

  This one seems most likely to happen -- remove the Legion-Prestige rewards, but you can still collect them by reaching X Prestige in the next expansion, and if you have enough Marks of Honor you can buy them using that currency. My concern is whether or not Marks of Honor will be reasonably collectible by non-PVPers like myself, and IF they attach a Prestige requirement to this, whether or not there will be a more "PVE" option to earn Honor like the PVP towers in Legion.

Those are just a few ideas on what could be implemented as either a catch-up mechanic or new method of collecting these pets. I'm sure there are many other good ideas out there. Who knows? Maybe developers already have something in store for us in the future.

Bottom line for me -- This grind is very discouraging and I sincerely hope there's a plan going forward to help PVP noobs like me, and to make sure the rewards are more accessible late in the expansion.

I'm doing the PVP tower WQs daily on two characters, not even Prestige rank 2 on either toon yet, and the end seems so far away. Add to that I Just. Don't. Know. How much time I have left to reach Prestige rank 7 before the end of the expansion and possibly the removal of the Prestige rewards.

If there's no time limit and the rewards will be available indefinitely, great! It won't be as nerve-wracking of a grind and maybe a catch-up mechanic won't be necessary.

But without having confirmation of one way or another....talk about a stressful endeavor. =\

Edit: Thanks to @Evolyn_Warcraft, here's a handy chart breaking down Honor earned and how much it will take to reach Prestige 7.

@perksnpeeves A draft of the total time it takes to get a WoW PvP pet:

(139 days, 1 hour, every day, rough estimate) pic.twitter.com/Dk52k5ku1h

— 🌿 Evolyn 🌿 (@Evolyn_Warcraft) June 25, 2017

According to this, at the current rate I'm going (3 PVP towers a day which equals to 1035 Honor/day - using a Guild Battle Standard) it will take me approximately 339 days to reach Prestige 7, minus 1.5 Prestige ranks and give or take a few days.

That's almost an entire year.

If (and that's a big 'if' since there's no official word) these Prestige rewards are going away at the end of Legion and there are no catch-up mechanics or changes.... then I hope this expansion has more than a year left to go. T_T

RE: PVP Prestige Battle Pets

UPDATE: Apparently it takes 50k Honor to Prestige each time. Season 2 will likely introduce 5 additional prestige ranks (without removing S1 ranks and rewards).

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Yesterday night I started the PVP Honor grind with a few guildmates. To sum up the experience:

• Arenas are not worth it. The Honor earned is just dismal.
• Battlegrounds are a little better (if you win, at least).
• PVP World Quests are the best in terms of Honor and time.

After hours and hours of grinding mainly bgs, I checked my Honor level and it was only 16. I had started the night at level 9. What.

I was incredulous. All of that and I had only earned 7 levels? Needless to say, I then realized that the Grind. Is. Real.

This made me stop and and seriously think about these PVP Prestige battle pets. Not only do I need to grind to Prestige 1, but I need to keep going and max out for this season so that I won't be behind once Season 2 comes out in 7.1. There is a new pet coming in S2 that, as a collector, I need to fulfill my gameplay.

Did I mention that all of this has to be done on Alliance AND Horde? I'll have to endure the grind on not just one character but two, just to collect these pets.

Is this worth it? How will other collectors fair? Why does it have to be this way?

@Spankyhunter @perksnpeeves ... and I think to the average collector the stick is starting to get too long to see the carrot any more

— Wayne Woods (@WayneGWoods) September 26, 2016

After some long and hard contemplation, I'm on the verge of excluding the Prestige pets completely. It pains me to even consider this, but trying out the grind and then realizing just how long of a journey it is (in quite possibly the most uncomfortable part of the game for me)... I just can't think of what my other options are.

At first, when I first heard about the Prestige pet (singular, not plural) I thought I would be ok. Prestige once and then be done, once on Alliance and then Horde - even someone who's as allergic to PVP as can be like me can manage that, right? But with the news of a second pet being introduced next season...that changes things.

It's incredibly disheartening and discouraging. Anxiety-inducing. Almost rage-inducing.

I'm already pretty lucky and have guildmates who will help, but what about collectors that don't have that luxury?

I don't want to over-generalize, but a good portion of the pet collecting community are just not that into PVP. Collecting is largely a solo-form of gameplay and fighting others is generally not necessary. "Care-bear" is thrown around a lot, but really, some just prefer to avoid certain activities that make the game less enjoyable for them. PVP is one of those activities.

It seems unfair to put collectors in this situation where they must choose between their collection (gameplay) and being coerced into a part of the game that they've chosen to largely avoid.

There are some collectors that love PVP, and that's great that they can collect while PVP'ing. But just like them, there are collectors that enjoy raiding, and some that don't. Some that like professions, others less so. Collectors that prefer making gold, and collectors that don't. And so on.

However, unlike every other aspect of the game, the PVP pets are only for those that PVP. There's simply no other way to collect them. Don't want to raid? That's ok, because the raid-dropped pets will be up on the Auction House in time. Same with many other pets that can initially only be obtained from a single source -- they can be traded and/or caged and thusly made available to many types of collectors.

Perhaps Blizzard wanted to put an emphasis on how special PVP is now, and that's why these pets are so exclusive. Raiding? Psh. That's just an everyday thing now, right? Some raiders will have words with you if that's the case.

So this whole PVP thing feels like a mistake. Adding in a reward that many PVP'ers will probably ignore and not benefit from, and placing that reward in an aspect of the game that collectors (that actually want the pet) try to avoid... it feels very underhanded as if something else is at play here. Like maybe WoW has this new shiny Prestige System that Blizzard wants us, everyone, to get into so that it's a HUGE SUCCESS! And what better way, than to add a pet, because you know collectors will flock to it, right?

Sorry for the sarcasm, I'm pretty upset about all of this.

I don't think Blizzard can take back what they've already implemented, nor do I think they want to. But I implore them to consider the following options for future PVP seasons:

1. Don't include a battle pet reward.

2. Include a battle pet reward, but make it tradeable/cageable so PVP'ers AND non-PVP'ers can benefit.

Option #2 seems to be the best of both worlds - you can reward PVP'ers for their efforts (doubly so since they will be able to make a one time profit from selling the pet if they choose to), and collectors that are actively avoiding PVP won't feel forced into an activity that they don't enjoy.

I hope I'm not alone in feeling this way about the Prestige PVP pets. As opposed as I am towards PVP, I'm open to compromise. I'm sure there's a better way to implement these pets without taking away from the PVP community, and simultaneously not excluding the collecting community.

PVP Exclusive Pet Possibly Coming In Legion?

I've always had a difficult time with PVP, both participating and mentally accepting the act of PVP'ing. So you can imagine the amount of dread that I feel when reading through the Legion PVP Preview blog that Blizzard recently posted. Specifically about the prestige rewards and "A unique mount and pet".

"All For The Prestige
However, once you've reached Honor Level 50, you'll have a tough choice to make. You'll be given the option to Prestige, which will reset your Honor Level back to 1, and once again restricting access to higher-level Honor Talents. However, in return, you'll increase your Prestige Level, which grants access to a number of other rewards, including:

• A badge, based on your Prestige Level, which appears on the scoreboard in Battlegrounds and Arenas, as well as on your nameplate and unit frame.
• A title, also based on your Prestige Level.
• A wearable faction pennant
• A new appearance for your Artifact
• A unique mount and pet

The higher your Prestige Level, the better rewards you'll have access to. We see the Prestige system as a great way for players who aren't interested in pursuing higher rating, but still enjoy PvP, to have their own unique rewards to chase after."

They don't discuss in detail how/when the pet will be awarded, so it's still up in the air what the exact requirements to be eligible for the pet will be.

At this time, the only sure thing I can say is...NOOOOO does not want! I detest PVP (even pet PVP).

However, because I'm lacking further information and details on the pet as well as the process necessary to earn the pet, I'll wait to formulate a concrete opinion on the matter.

I mean, maybe it won't be all that bad? Perhaps the only requirement will be to reach Prestige level 1 (Honor level 50). That will just be a matter of grinding Honor until reaching cap, and only just the one time.

Then again, it could just as well be something like "reach Prestige level 20", which would mean reaching Honor level 50 multiple times (20 times)...and that might make me lose more than a few nights' worth of sleep and some hair.

I definitely am NOT hoping for the latter. As a pet collector, I will feel obligated to collect whatever this PVP exclusive pet will be. And I can only speak for myself, but PVP is not an activity that I actively seek out. It's just not my thing; I don't enjoy it and feel extremely stressed out when faced with PVP. So while this is all "optional", in the end I will still feel as though I'm being cornered into participating in an aspect of the game that I would rather not take part in.

I know some will thrive in this type of situation and are probably ecstatic that they will get to play two very different aspects of the game at the same time. And that's great! Everyone should be able to enjoy this game in their own way.

I just hope that Blizzard chooses the path of compromise between those that want PVP and those that don't want PVP. Prestige 1? Maybe even Honor level XX? Ok, I will buckle down, hold my tongue, and do it for the pet. That's not too much to ask of me so someone else can enjoy collecting while PVP'ing, right? We'll see.

I'm crossing my fingers for a quick and fairly painless process for the PVP pet. I mean, not only do I not want to be in a battleground, I'm sure avid PVP'ers will probably cringe at having my inexperienced and poor PVP skills in their highly competitive game space. The less time I have to spend "ruining" their games, the better...right? lol *is reminded of the Children's Week PVP achievement*

Anyway, until more information is given, I'll sit and wait. Anxiously wait. *stressed* Hope for the best, prepare for the worst? =\

Details I'm most eager to learn more about:

• What the pet will be and if it's truly exclusive to this activity (PVP, or will it be available through some other means?)
• Prestige level required to earn the pet
• The rate at which you earn honor and time necessary to earn Prestige
• Any possible limitations on the pet (Will the ability to summon it require you to maintain a certain honor/prestige level? Or is it yours to keep forever once earned?)